Hello all

I lined up at a telechoice in sydney and got a 16gig white iphone on friday morning. I watched people told they needed to come back because their contract would not go through and that meant they could not get their Iphone

I went, contract went through, I signed it, got given my phone and went about my day.

My phone still had no service on Saturday and Optus told me they had not recieved the sim activation from Tele choice. NOw I get a phone call on Saturday Morning from telechoice telling me my contract was declined and I needed to bring back in my phone - I questioned why I was given a phone and signed contracts while I watched other people turned away - I got ums and Ahhs and then got told that if I did not bring the phone back they would get creditors on me. I asked for their managers number which I was then told "He doesn't like people ringing him to question his staff"
The head office was closed on saturday so I have to ring monday.

Can anyone tell me my rights at this point??? I was given the phone and signed everything and was let out of the store with the phone...
I don't know what to do

I would take this up with Optus as far as the contract goes. Your contract is with them and not Telechoice.

you need to make a call to your consumer affairs on Monday morning or the TIO.

Good luck, I hope there is a good outcome for you!

BTW: Good call on the white iPhone

Keep it, screw them.

Hmm, Contract law was many, many semesters ago...

Contract.
1. Intent - you both intended to enter into a legal agreement
2. Offer - they advertised a price, you made an offer to purchase the goods at that price and they accepted it
3. Legal agreement - you signed a contract to confirm the agreement between the 2 parties.
4. Consideration - you paid them money to confirm the acceptance of the transaction

Is there any term or condition in the contract that you signed that says you have to return the phone upon request? Can you ask then which section of the contract they are referring to?

The Creditors threat is just a bluff in my consideration. Anyway, they cannot refer you to creditrs until they send you a bill, you don't pay it, they send you a letter of demand, you don't pay it, THEN they refer your debt to Creditors.

Get them to clarify what exactly they want you to do, and why - IN WRITING! In fact, demand ALL further interactions from them to you to be in writing only. If they persist in phoning you, respond in writing, documenting their conversation. In fact, respond to them in writing citing the previous conversation you mentioned in your post, then state your facts as to why you disagree.

Then get the ACCC to lokk at this transaction and get their advice. Personally, I think they'll cave under their empty threats the first time you push back! (But, I'm not a solicitor, so get a paper-trail started!)

Ang

EDIT: Just had another thought re the threat to refer you to "creditos". Err, what exactly is your unpaid debt?

Good call Ang...I had a protracted argument with 3 that lasted over a year with the TIO and it was the paper trail that saved me. I made it explicit in my first letter to them that I would only accept correspondence from them in writing.

let us know how you go...will be interesting to see what they reckon the case is

Why was your contract declined? Did they give a reason?

They said they would get creditors on me if I did not bring back the phone, that was all they said on that one.

They said optus did not let me have the phone cause of my credit history... I don't know why this was seeing two months ago I got a phone contract with Telstra and it was all ok....

I'd be going through Optus on this one now...if Optus rejected your contract you should deal with them.

Find out your rights from consumer affairs (ie can you keep it until this is sorted or does it need to be taken back directly...my gut feeling is that everything you did was in good faith so you should be able to keep it until the situation is cleared up)

Tell Telechoice you will be dealing with Optus directly and you have spoken with consumer affairs and you can keep it (provided of course that you can) . Get onto Optus and find out why the contract was declined. I don't recall whether they will tell you the name of the creditor that has listed you (i think they can) then you will know what is going on. If not you need to ring Baycorp Advantage (I think they are still called this) who do most of the credit files for Australia. Problem is to get them to act on this straight away you need to pay something like $30 for a copy of your credit file. You can request it for free, but you have to apply to them in writing and they have to reply in writing etc so snail mail gets a little slow (mind you this could work to your advantage!)

Once you know the creditor that has defaulted you, you can contact them to discuss it. The defaulting creditor is the only one who can remove a listing if it is in error, if it isn't when you pay the outstanding out it will list that you have paid it, but it will stay there for I think 5 years...(at least I think it is 5)

The other reason someone may decline you credit is if you have a lot of credit applications. A relative of mine had this happen. They were comparing a few personal loans, applied for them but didn't take the money, then they applied for a good rate later down the track and were refused because they had a number of other applications for credit on their file.

Get it straightened out before you do anything. You made payment/completed contract in good faith, they accepted that...there is no reason in the world they can call in creditors or whatever on this at this stage. If you don't take it back worst they can do is bill you for the full amount which won't have any standing as there is a question over the entire transaction in the first place...so you could stretch this out for a while.

The most important thing to remember is you conducted this transaction "in good faith" in good faith that they did their job properly in completing the contract and the obligations thereof, good faith that all was ok when they approved it and good faith that to the best of your knowledge there was no reason that they shouldn't have refused you the contract.

I hope this is of some help and it is only my two cents worth from a few fistycuffs I have had over the years

That's a tough call, and a bit of an inconvenience for you to return and especially if you can't activate/use the phone. I'd probably attempt to sort this out through optus, but they may give you the runaround and may require you to deal with the reseller.

If there is a way to check your credit history I'd do that - it would be nice if they gave you more information..; also a quick call to consumer affairs will provide further info as to your rights/obligations.

hope its sorted soon..

Welcome to Mactalk Bateman! And good luck! Hope you resolve this quickly.

That said, How does a contract go through if it was already declined?

sorta similar thing happened to me cept a number was activated. Our business account was approved, one number was ported over and then the other three were rejected. Now Optus look like offering to pay for my contract with telstra to go back with telstra.

Anyway, there really isnt much you can do. I would definitely tell optus how you have already opened the phone and destroyed the box it came in. THIS IS IMPORTANT. ( i used to manage several optus outlets). If there is no packaging no-one will want to take it back (well highly unlikely). Telechoice wont be able to send it back and optus wont accept it. You may find their enthusiasm to ensure your contract gets activated is rather more eager.

Did you also happen to engrave your name on it?

They cant make you pay for it without giving you an account - that's what you signed up for. You purchased on account / prepaid, went home opened it up, threw the box out and engraved you drivers licence/name on the back of it so it was identifiable. This is all perfectly reasonable becasue you believed the phone was now yours.

They cant call debt collector on to you because you have a contract for an iphone and optus service, you were told everything was fine with the credit check. But here is your problem - are you willing to take them to court to give you a mobile phone account. I dont think the TIO can do much about it unless you have either paid money upfront or the account was activated. if you had paid the monthly amount for the phone upfront then you are laughing because at the time they took your money the contract had begun. You see at this stage if you havent paid them anything only they have something to lose. They cant make you pay for the phone but they may choose to offer it to you outright, activate your account or just request you return the unboxed and engraved phone.

Definitely put it all in writing and get everyone to send you confirmation of your conversations via email or get them to fax you something.

No matter what, file a complaint with the TIO. Even if you end up having to give it back it will go down as a strike against optus with the TIO. And if you file with the TIO they cant ask for the phone back til the TIO advises you. This could take a few weeks.

So give optus a go first then when you cant get a person that is allowed to use their brain to make a decision file with the TIO. They will then give you the number of someone who handles TIO complaints at optus - they are the people that can override the activations process.

But let me say this. If you have a pretty bad credit history then Optus will dig their heels in and you should just take the phone back. If it's something that can be explained and justified then you have a chance

The other consideration here is that telechoice told you everything was fine. not only have they probably not adhered 100% to procedure here, it could Very well turn out that it was their mistake and they have to wear it in some way. eg you buy an item listed for 100$ and if it only scans @ 20$ and the retailer doesn't pick it up and they let you walk out of there with it, there isn't a great deal they can do (however because a contract is involved here the circumstances are different).

When talking to optus make sure you complain about how this has been handled esp the telechoice person refusing to let you speak to a mgr.

Hello all

I have spoken to Fair Trading who refered me to TIO..> They gave me a ref number and told me to ring optus complaints who I then lodged a complaint. Even the lady said they should not have let me sign a contract and leave the store with the phone.
Lets see what happens in the next 10 days

Brilliant would be awesome if Telechoice had to wear the cost of the phone :P you might have scored a free/heavily discounted one...make sure you contact Telechoice to inform them the matter has been taken up with the TIO/Optus....they'll probably be shaking in their boots!

absolutely agree.