[arkenstone]

Siemens Gigaset C470IP VOIP Cordless Phone Review

I wrote this article about a month ago but with a fairly mental workload at My Real Job, it kind of got put on the back burner.

My interest in the C470 IP was originally peaked when I asked on Whirlpool about some handset suggestions last year when I wasn't satisfied with the Telstra E5100 handsets I was using with my Billion 7404VGP. The original problem was that my E5100's wouldn't audibly 'ring' when a call came in over the VOIP line - they'd display the calling party's number, but not audibly ring. This gave me a good excuse to change to an all digital setup anyway - I didn't like the unnecessary conversion to analogue and back again. When Decryption mentioned a month or so ago he'd been given one as a review unit - I jumped at the chance to get my hands on one.

VOIP Basics
I guess a bit of background is required on VOIP setups and how they work. First of all your digital handset records and encodes your voice as a digital stream, then it sends it as a digital stream to the base station. So so far we've got Voice -> DECT handset -> base station.

The next step differs on your setup. If you have a standard PSTN (Public Switched Telephone Network) service, at this point your call is converted to analogue and enters the network to be switched about and bastardised by Telstra. If you've got a modem/router that does PSTN and VOIP switching or Least Cost Routing, you can plug a device like Billion's 7404 series into a land line and also set up a VOIP service on it. From there by setting up detailed dial plans your calls can be routed on the fly to go over the appropriate service. Local or interstate call? Route it over the VOIP service. Location dependent or free call (such as 000, 13 numbers or 1800 numbers)? route it over the PSTN.

This worked great but because the handsets I were using were designed for the PSTN there was this extra level of digital->analogue->digital conversion happening most of the time when I made VOIP calls, which were 99.99% of the calls I made. So the path of my voice would be something like:

1. My voice travels as an analogue sound wave to the DECT handset
2. DECT handset then essentially records this and sends it digitally to the basestation
3. Base station sends an analogue signal to the modem/router/SIP device (because it's designed for the PSTN)
4. Modem sends a digital signal over the internet to your VOIP provider.
5. Your VOIP provider then converts this signal back to an analogue signal so it can travel over the PSTN to whoever it is that you're calling.

So, in the above scenario the signal would be Analogue, Digital, Analogue, Digital, Analogue.

Obviously the first Analogue component we can't change until we can plug a phone into our brain or something and the last part is dependant on who it is you're calling. Unless you're calling another VOIP user, the chances are this last step will always be analogue. So removing the two bits you can't change we're left with a Digital->Analogue->Digital conversion path. Every one of these conversions affects the audio signal somewhat. You can't make a smooth sine wave with ones and zeros and vice versa.

The benefits of using a DECT handset with an ethernet enabled base station like the Siemens Gigaset c470IP is that you skip this first Digital->Analogue conversion because your SIP device and your base station are the one device. This reduces the number of conversions that are necessary and essentially makes sure the call is digital for as much of the path as possible. This should in theory improve sound quality. More on this later.

The C470IP does have a RJ12 connector on it though, so you can use it as a switching or cheapest-call-routing device if you so want. Remember if your family has a high liklihood of needing to call Emergency services you should stick to your PSTN line. Because it's got both Ethernet and PSTN interfaces it makes a good and reasonably inexpensive first piece of VOIP hardware. The fact it's got both in one saves you from having to buy a new ADSL modem/router to start using VOIP as your native telephone service, too. So on to the actual review

What's in the box?
My box had been previously opened by evil overlord Decryption so we'll take the manufacturer's word that it contains

• A Documentation CD
• A handset
• Handset charging station
• The base station
• 1x RJ12 cable
• 1x RJ45 cable
• Quick setup instruction guide
• Warranty card

None of this is exciting enough to warrant pictures, I assure you. So what about setup?

Setup
As I mentioned above, my setup was going to be VOIP only. As a result setup for me was pretty simple. For the hardware side of things all I had to do was plug in the base station and the handset charging station. It was at this point I found a handy feature on the base station - one of those things that makes you realise someone actually put some thought into the design of their product. I pushed the lit up blue button on the front and it paged the handset. This wasn't so remarkable in itself but the handset also displayed the IP address of the base station. This kind of thing is invaluable for people like me who like to statically assign IP's to the devices on the network that aren't true clients (printers, base stations, servers, routers, APs, etc.). It could save you quite a bit of time trying to remember if it's a printer or a VOIP base station or a wireless AP at 192.168.0.5. Already I was excited about the setup of the product.

So then I got to the software side. I didn't bother looking at the documentation CD, I just fired up a browser and pointed it to the IP the phone gave me earlier:

This is the greeting page. Just a simple clean language and simple authentication prompt. Once you authenticate you get dropped at this page, which explains what to do next. Unless you're trying to some pretty freaky stuff or you're running your own Asterix server or something I don't think too many people will need to go delving for the documentation CD.

From there you can jump to all sorts of places. I'll only discuss the more interesting ones.

Here we can see just how ridiculously easy it is to create dialing plans on the go for people with a combined PSTN/VOIP setup. Free calls to Telstra mobiles? Chuck the numbers in here and tell them to use the fixed line. Call interstate a lot? Tell it to always use VOIP for other area codes. It's also advisable at this screen to add in 000, 1800 and 13 numbers to use the fixed line. If these calls are sent out over your VOIP line the other party won't be able to get your location which is handy when you're calling Pizza Hut or absolutely critical if you're calling 000.

Quick disclaimer at this point. If you or anyone at your house is likely to need emergency services, I'd strongly recommend you retain a landline for this function. If the person calling 000 is incapacitated or otherwise unable to talk it could make a big difference.

The Gigaset's multiple entry interface is a dream. On the Billion you had to telnet dial rules in because a bug on the web-entry screen wouldn't allow entries of more than 200 characters or something.

Here you can see you can program the different mail boxes. Telstra landline? 101. NodePhone? 111, Someone else again? could be 333. Who knows. With the Gigaset's support so many different VOIP providers, it'll also prompt you when you press the voicemail button on the handset as to which mailbox it is that you want to call.

One of the most interesting features of the phone though I only discovered through reading the manual while preparing this review. The 'Services' menu actually allows you to stream information services to your phone when it's not active (by default if the phone is charging, the display will remain lit. What these services allow you to do is change the time display to something more interesting such as weather, horoscopes, RSS feeds, eBay - Yep. It'll even track eBay auctions for you! All you need to do is provide it with the auction number and it'll tell you the time remaining and current bid right on the display of the handset. Awesome-sauce. So, we've established the hardware's pretty clever. What's it like to use?

Usability
Unfortunately the handset menus are a little convoluted. Menu layout and bullshit weird named options remind me of the menu system from one of the early Motorola V3s. What's with that?

While it's disappointing it's not the end of the world for my needs. I really will only be using the handsets to make calls. Extra features buried in these menus like checking-an-email-account and SMS capabilities I won't be likely to use. I also don't hold out much faith the built in idle RSS reader would cope well with Lolcats, but it might be reasonably well suited to Jack Bauer or Chuck Norris facts. The handset does include a speaker-phone function, can call internally and do everything else you'd expect from a reasonable DECT phone. The base station also will allegedly pair with other DECT handsets, but I've not tried this out yet. The real thing I was hanging to test out was sound quality.

Audio Quality
We'd eliminated two analogue -> digital and back again conversions, remember? How much difference would the fact I'm using real-world VOIP aware equipment over my cheap-as-chips-second-hand-on-eBay-plugged-into-my-ADSL-Modem setup? Unfortunately not much. For the calls we do make interstate and to PSTN lines, the difference isn't really noticeable. Don't get me wrong, the call is crystal clear and sounds great for a phone-call, but it still sounds like a phone call.

I'm eager to test this against other VOIP users though, specifically those on my own VOIP network (NodePhone). Perhaps I should give Internode a call and shoot the breeze just to test the quality

So unfortunately for my use the difference in quality isn't measurable or even really identifiable, but I'm confident this is due to limitations in the PSTN, rather than my own equipment.

Conclusion
So is this worth it? MaxoTel currently have this bundle for $164.95, which sounds pretty reasonable but it is only one handset + the base station. Secondary handsets MaxoTel are selling for around the $90 mark (but it's exciting they're selling them at all - I spent a while six months ago trying to track down a local distributor and couldn't EDIT: Since I wrote this article things have gotten a lot better. Not only are MaxoTel now stocking these but Internode are too - though at a premium because of the extra support). If you live in a one bedroom house and don't have a cordless phone, get it. It'll save you the hassle of getting a new modem.

If you've got a big house or you want one in the kitchen, lounge room, study and bedroom, you're going to be up for $435 odd dollars for four handsets and a base station. This is considerably more expensive than a three or four handset DECT setup from eBay for $100 and a sub $200 SIP capable router. If you've already got a three or four handset setup then your total outlay for joining the VOIP world drops to about what you'd pay for the handset and base station here.

I'm looking at migrating my mum to Naked DSL and VOIP to save her $50 a month and I'm currently going through this very same dilemma. She's going to need at least two handsets and her current modem doesn't do Wifi or SIP. I'll probably end up upgrading her DSL modem instead. That way the change will be more transparent for her.

It really is a great device, there are just too many other options at the same price point or less. Since you're probably a Mac user, you don't mind paying a bit extra for quality and function.

Recommended.

[AlexR]

Check the codec you were using - by default they use a compressed G729 codec. You're much better off using alaw (g711a)

[AlexR]

MaxoTel offers the C470IP for $149.95 and the C47H at $84.95. Simply order using the MaxoTel online shop.

The double handset bundle is $239.95 which saves you more compared to buying the C470IP and the extra handset separately.

[BoxDog]

Excellent review Arkenstone.

I have the Siemens S685IP (not available yet, if ever, in Australia) which is the sleeker, sexier version of this unit. I bought it for a couple of specific reasons that wouldn't apply to the bulk of people, and had to import it from the UK, it cost me about $220 for the single headset+base pack including freight.

I've got some experience under my belt with VOIP in consumer, commercial and enterprise settings and did my due diligence while looking around for a DECT handset at home. I'ld recommend the C470IP in a split second to anybody fitting the 'bulk' of people as above. It's a simple to use, wife friendly and reliable phone with great battery life and excellent sound quality. This is mostly because you're keeping the voice as a digital bitstream end to end. The S685IP has better accoustics though because it's g722 capable but for all intents and purposes I know the C470IP also has excellent narrowband quality kit. This is important to me because I'm a tryhard audiophile who tries to make up for lack of penis size with hi fidelity deliciousness.

I'ld like to reiterate what Arkenstone said and strongly suggest you connect the PSTN port to your damn phone line and set up the dialplan to route '000' to the fixed line. Goddamn it! Argh. Unless you're bionic matter over a metal endoskeleton you may need emergency services at any minute and even a reputable VOIP provider like Maxotel is still at the mercy of your pathetic, excuse-driven ISP and cheap Asian-sourced DSL router. Plus if you dial from your PSTN line and can't talk because you're in a pile on the floor choking on your own vomit, they might not get your address out of your caller ID info. Do me a favour and plug it in boys and girls. Practise safe telephony. (tm)

On that note, while not having any connection to AlexR and MaxoTel, let me also point out this is one damn fine VSP and you should all just go with him instead of your pathetic ISP's even more pathetic voice service, where they offer you some even more pathetic service that doesn't work properly because they're a damn ISP trying to multitask and having no fricking idea what planet they're on. Maxotel's switched out of a datacenter in NSW right off the PIPE peering exchange which your pathetic ISP probably peers on so latency will be at a minimum. He's got a special for MacTalk users (you'ld have to check), sells these damn DECT phones too, and the site he has built is pretty good - you can go in and set up multiple extensions and voicemails and DIDs and stuff too.

Just to show I'm not biased through some kind of commmission for saying nice things, I'll also shout out Pennytel because they're pretty good service quality wise, and their self service site is top notch too, but their support is shit.

One thing they do which I havent found a way to copy in Maxo yet is that you can define a fixed line as a source ID - so if you call out using Pennytel to 000, they'll receive the Caller ID as your FIXED line rather than some random Pennytel pilot number, which sounds good in principal, however from experience I can tell you this doesnt always work.

AlexR any way we can enable the same on Maxo so our geographically located calls to pizza hut go through to the branch down the road?

By the way Arkenstone - the reason your old DECT phone wasn't ringing was probably because the ringer cadence settings on your Billion router were incorrect somehow - or the Billion is faulty and not generating the ring voltage required to make the ringers go off (?). Wouldn't surprise me. I have the exact same model and it's buggy to all shit even with latest firmware. (One other thing do you have any problems with its' wifi playing nicely with a Macbook especially using WPA2?)

[tmansour]

Interesting review ... I had just noticed this handset at MyNetFone and was wondering what it would be like.

Oh, and putting on my editorial cap: one's interest (or appetite) is said to have been "piqued" -- not "peaked".

[cejay]

I bought one of these via the WP offer from Freshtel. An outrageous cheap deal and an excellent phone.

I have a 7401VGP and I have noticed a marked improvement in call quality. But that could also have been the DECT phone I was using with it.

[GregA]

Damn, lost my post.

Does anyone know if there are similar phones (competitors) to the Siemens - 18 months ago I was looking for EXACTLY this kind of phone.

Also, I assume you can transfer calls between handsets ?

[Jivec]

What voip sevices is everyone on?

[GregA]

We use Mytel at my work - very reliable but higher cost.
We use gotalk at my wife's work (voip & a 1300 number).
My father uses net2max/oztell - really crappy interface but seems to work okay, and
my wife's work uses net2max/oztell for incoming fax-to-email.
I use iiNet's iiTalk at home, works well.
Looking at Maxotel for my mother's home.

My wife's work used to use bbpglobal but had problems.

[tmansour]

I'm connected to Internode so I have a VOIP with them; they claim to deploy an optimised VOIP network so their charges are a little higher (18c a call) but quality and reliability are excellent. I also have an account with MyNetFone which is excellent value and have recommended them to a number of family and friends.

[Aladdin]

I'm with MyNetFone, and have recently churned by ADSL to Internode. Not sure whether I should opt for NodePhone, partly because of the (almost double) higher cost. At 18c per local call, I feel that I may as well use PSTN.

MNF is good most of the time, but on occasions, call quality is sub-sub-par. Usually fixed by hanging up and re-dialling (negates any cost savings, though).

tmansour, how would you rate NodePhone vs MNF vs PSTN for call quality?

[tmansour]

I was using MyNetFone for some years and was on Internode but then changed to an Internode naked plan to ditch Telstra. As you say, MNF could be occasionally dodgy but for the price you couldn't complain. My Internode plan includes a NodePhone2 service so I'm happy to use that instead now ... I do a lot of interstate calls so 18c untimed is still cheap for me. I do think NodePhone is better quality; can't remember a garbled call and sounds better, but MNF can be just as good so I suppose the main (perceived) difference is consistency/reliability of calls.

[BoxDog]

Originally Posted by GregA

Damn, lost my post.

Does anyone know if there are similar phones (competitors) to the Siemens - 18 months ago I was looking for EXACTLY this kind of phone.

Also, I assume you can transfer calls between handsets ?

There's the SNOM M3 (I think) and an Aastra model. Both are $$$$.

[cejay]

I use Nodephone and the local calls issue isn't for me, as most calls are interstate. Therefore 18c untimed is still good value (for me).

Quality is exceptional, I've never had a call drop or garble (my 7401 was the issue with a dodgy codec). NP2 means that although I pay for the Telstra landline I never receive or make calls through them.

[kmcgreg]

Hi I just bought a Siemens C470IP for Voip but cant get it to work with iinet = I get provider registration failed - anyone else using this phone with iinet. I have it connected to a D-Link 604T.

If feel like a total noob trying to get this to work. Help!

[kmcgreg]

all cool - i worked it out myself in the end

[arkenstone]

Well in the interests of helping others that might come across this thread when searching on their own troubles, how about telling us what was wrong?

[DeKa]

I bought one of these today and wanted to add a note about how great it is.
I have been using a Uniden DSS cordless phone with an SPA-3102 for 2.5 years, using iiNet's iiTalk (free landline calls service) with their Naked DSL, and Pennytel for all other calls. Quality has always been good.

The C470IP takes voice quality to a whole new level. It is so easy to configure as well. My only complaint is the web interface is very slow - I can only assume it has a slow processor, mainly focussed on voice capabilities.

Dial plans are incredibly easy to set up. I have International 0011... going to Pennytel, Mobile 04.... going to Pennytel, and everything else goes via iiTalk.

It can handle multiple inbound and outbound calls from the same VSP, so it essentially gives you a PABX style system in the home.

[BoxDog]

Where are you guys buying this model from these days?

[DeKa]

Maxotel